Changemakers: The Radical AI Podcast
The Radical AI Podcast is hosted by Rev. Dylan Doyle-Burke and Jessie J. Smith. Dylan is a former minister and current Religious Studies PhD student at the University of Denver implementing Religious Studies methodology into user-centered technology design practices. Jess is a CS and Information Science PhD student at the University of Colorado Boulder researching ML and AI ethics with an emphasis on multi-stakeholder algorithmic fairness and transparency.
“Not a single person who we have featured has what would be considered a ‘traditional path’ to where they are. It is the weird people and the courageous people and the people who are unafraid about just how passionate and nerdy they are about the Responsible Tech field that make a name for themselves.” -Rev. Dylan Doyle-Burke and Jessie J. Smith of The Radical AI Podcast
Tell us about the Radical AI Podcast?
The Radical AI Podcast is one of the largest and fastest growing AI Ethics/Responsible Tech podcasts in the world. Our mission is to be a platform for radical people, radical ideas, and radical stories in the field of AI Ethics/Responsible Tech. What does it mean to be radical in the tech space? That is exactly what we are trying to find out!
We founded Radical AI as a public scholarship non-profit organization focused on centering the voices of those who have been historically marginalized in AI and tech spaces. Specifically, we are dedicated to supporting, sharing, and featuring the stories of people of color, women, and the LGBTQIA community, among others. Our podcast and the organization behind it are driven by values of equity, justice, hope, authenticity, accessibility, and love.
Since launching in April of 2020 we have produced over 40 episodes, including more than 30 stand-alone interviews, bonus panel conversations, and partnership episodes with groups such as All Tech Is Human, Ethical Intelligence, and others. Our guests and topics have ranged from Dr. Ruha Benjamin of Princeton speaking about racial justice in the tech sector, to Dr. Timnit Gebru of Google AI speaking about critical race theory as it relates to representation in AI design teams, to Dr. Anima Anandkumar speaking about democratizing AI, to everything in between. We are an intentionally interdisciplinary podcast dedicated to making the complex ethical landscape of AI, machine learning, and technology accessible for everyone.
What was the reason for starting your podcast?
It all started when we first met at the FAccT Conference (formerly FAT*) in Barcelona, Spain in February 2020, drawn together by a common interest in AI Ethics and exploring research questions about applying human-centered concepts of fairness to AI design practices.
Bluntly, the podcast was started because of our mutual frustration of the status quo in academia and the tech sector. We had both experienced moments in our academic and industry contexts where interdisciplinary and diverse voices had been implicitly or explicitly silenced. Dylan’s positionality as a humanities scholar constantly ostracized in tech spaces and Jessie’s experience as a young woman in tech facing down sexism and ageism invited us both to think more deeply about what other voices and stories were not being included in the responsible tech conversation.
As we did more research about podcasts in the AI Ethics space we realized that there was no dedicated space for voices outside of the status quo to have their voices heard by the general public. So we decided to make one.
What have you learned about the Responsible Tech field by running the Radical AI Podcast?
Through our interviews and connections with some of the most respected voices in the Responsible Tech field we have learned quite a bit about where the field has been and where it is going.
The biggest takeaway for us has been learning that the Responsible Tech field is still actively in formation. Though there are many companies and individuals who are leading the way towards defining what Responsible Tech is or is not, that definition is far from stable. In fact, what is clear to us is that we as a Responsible Tech community are in the midst of a vital stage in our development where we are deciding who we will become and what our values are.
A related takeaway is that the Responsible Tech field is not just a single field. Rather, in its current form it is a quintessentially interdisciplinary space. There are engineers, sociologists, anthropologists, computer scientists, psychologists, data scientists, politicians, and so many more -- all who are involved in the Responsible Tech conversation. It is a lively and vigorous space that is transforming daily.
Finally, we have learned that, put simply, there are some amazing, caring, and brilliant people in this space. We have been floored by the level of support we have received from our guests, listeners, and organizational partners. There are many challenges yet to come for the Responsible Tech field but we would be amiss to not point out just how giving, loving, and visionary so many in this community demonstrate themselves to be on a daily basis.
People are looking for entry points into the Responsible Tech ecosystem, and your podcast features many of the leading voices in the field. What have you learned from the podcast that can be advice for others trying to break into the field?
This is the part where we answer in a series of fun clichés.
First - do your research. Don’t be afraid to reach out to the people you admire and build relationships; real relationships, not just business relationships where you expect to get something in return. Name what you need and do not be deterred when people say no (you should see the hundreds of rejection letters we have between the two of us!!)
Not a single person who we have featured has what would be considered a ‘traditional path’ to where they are. It is the weird people and the courageous people and the people who are unafraid about just how passionate and nerdy they are about the Responsible Tech field that make a name for themselves. Don’t give up, be at the right place at the right time, know clearly what you want, and find a way to get lucky.
And when your luck inevitably runs out, have the audacity to make your own podcast or platform.
Where would you like to see the Responsible Tech field in five years?
The Responsible Tech field is at a tipping point. It will either shrivel and die under the weight of paying lip service to the values that led to its inception or it will bloom and thrive into the sustainable, radically representative human-centered community that we believe it can be. The reality is that the most terrifying thing about this tipping point is also the most empowering; what this field looks like in five years is fully and unapologetically up to us. If you are reading this you have a voice in the development of this field.
The needs of our world necessitate a Responsible Tech field that is willing to look past its own navel to holistically and dynamically engage with the most complex and challenging issues that are facing our communities. We chose the word radical for our podcast because we believe that the tech sector has engaged with these pivotal issues by huddling too close to the safety of the status quo.
We believe we need visionary leaders that are willing to do the uncomfortable work of digging to the root of the problems that negatively impact our most vulnerable communities. And we invite all of you to join with us in doing that work as we journey together towards creating a Responsible Tech field that creates a better and more just world for us all.
Contact Dylan & Jess at @RadicalAIPod & listen at RadicalAI.org
The Radical AI Podcast & All Tech Is Human have partnered up to establish a Continue the Conversation series, which includes a podcast, action items, and follow-up resources to All Tech Is Human's livestream series with TheBridge.